My Hero Academia II - Bhyyyyyyyyy

[Lord Gaimon]

I don't think so, because there a remarkably difference in how things went. Dr. Shiro and the whole unit got pardoned by the US because they were interested in the result of the biological warfare tests. They criminals walked away, and opposed to the German approach of reprimand it's war criminals and the war crimes, Japan approach is deny or obfuscate the facts, they never fully comdem it.

ok? what does that have to do with what i said.

[pariston_hill]

ok? what does that have to do with what i said.

It don't bring focus, at least not to the target audience. Is just kinda naming your crazy scientist that does human experimentation Menguele un-ironicaly.

[Lord Gaimon]

It don't bring focus, at least not to the target audience. Is just kinda naming your crazy scientist that does human experimentation Menguele un-ironicaly.

it doesn't really matter if it actually brings focus or not, i just don't think it can be considered dismissive or "problematic" or anything like that.

[pariston_hill]

it doesn't really matter if it actually brings focus or not, i just don't think it can be considered dismissive or "problematic' or anything like that.

But it is offensive to those that have family member that survived these experiments, such as the chinese and koreans.
It's like produce "Spring time for Hitler" in a serious manner, and expect the jews, catholic poles, slavs, roma, homosexuals and physical and mentally disable people to not take offense in using the imagery or name in a non condemning way.

[Lord Gaimon]

But it is offensive to those that have family member that survived these experiments, such as the chinese and koreans.
It's like produce "Spring time for Hitler" in a serious manner, and expect the jews, catholic poles, slavs, roma, homosexuals and physical and mentally disable people to not take offense in using the imagery or name in a non condemning way.

the character being named is literally an evil scientist who experiments on people, how is it non condemning? also spring time for hitler? really? talk about reaching.

[pariston_hill]

the character being named is literally an evil scientist who experiments on people, how is it non condemning? also spring time for hitler? really? talk about reaching.

We no Dr. Ujiko is a monster, people in the story know he is a monster, but Hori by ignorance or choice choose to name him in an allusion to a war crime. Naming a monster after a monstruos act is not equal to condem the act, is more akin to a dark sense of humor. In the same fashion Kubo made de quince army dress like SS soldiers, out of ignorance or deliberate choice. The fact the the enemy of the heroes are dressed akin to war criminals does not condem the war criminals, or the characters themselves.
Like I said earlier, a better wood pun could have avoided it altogether.

And yeah, Spring time for Hitler, I can't think out of the top of my of another instance in major western culture were some fictional character tried to play a straight homenaje to a war criminal.

[Razh]

In the same fashion Kubo made de quince army dress like SS soldiers, out of ignorance or deliberate choice.

Just to add the uniforms themselves didn't look especially SS-like. It's the needless German terminology that added to it more.

And I think there was nothing especially wrong with it. Censorship was one of the tools of the regime the SS army, for example, had served. Of course, there's always a fine line of good taste but people complain too much about anything these days. Not sure it's always a good idea to give in and make alterations.

[DestinyDogma]

The doctor thing was, at the very least, in poor taste and tone-deaf, making the change and giving an apology was the natural thing to do. People, of course , can believe his apology or not, but there really isn´t anything else Hori could do about that.

Talking about the series itself, I am wondering if after this arc is over MHA will get the shippuden treatment, just a regular time skip or no time-skip at all.

[zeltrax225]

Nothing is above criticism but everything is to be approached with understanding.
An author will not be able to check all the list and satisfy all the different political viewpoints.


Depicting something as good means that something else will is bad. There's no way to go around it, you can't satisfy both parties.
There's no sage like writer out there that is going to get every character right but just what society perceived feels right.
Breakthrough stories always break fictional troupes(Hunter, Thrones) and they work because fictional troupes can be mistaken ideals in the first place.
Our world doesn't even have all the answers to issues that has plague us for years. Expecting a fictional series to do that is fine because ideally stories paint a perfect world.
But stories are crafted from humans who are filled with flaws and bias, there should be some degree of understanding there.
You can fault the guy and at best call him ignorance but labelling him feels like it's too much especially when you considering his eastern environment.

Horikoshi un/intentionally misrepresented mental health (I'm not sure if it even is misrepresented as much as misaligned) and did a certain LGBT character dirty.
That's upsetting but unfortunately this story never shown any signs to be focusing on the latter as an issue.
I don't like alot of things about this shounen jump genre but when coming in and when you have been reading jump long enough, you should have a good idea of the market, demographic and the environment it caters to.
Sexism and masculinity over feminity goes a long way back. Mental health issues was never a thing.
I believe it will be very nice if Jump becomes a lot more progressive and I like to argue that it actually is.
A lot of new manga have been sexualising the females a lot lesser compared to a decade or two ago.
It's slow but it is moving, just not at the pace we want it to be and that is understandably because of the country's culture.

He's not going to be this revolutionary flag holder of a mangaka in an environment that doesn't actively encourage it.
He can, but I don't think, at this point of time he has a good grasp and the ability to do that.
Unless he grow to have a strong handle of the issues he's tackling and is willing to take certain risks, which, we'll see but I won't have my hopes up the HIGHEST for that aspect.
If that's the reason, then your expectations are at the wrong place.


If you havent yet, know what you're getting into and reading. Having expectations is fine but superimposing/projecting your ideals into a series that was never focusing on your ideals is not.

[JulieYBM]

That's why we must be critical, so that Horikoshi, JUMP editorial and more are held to a standard. This "oh, well!" attitude is antithetical to even the most barebones position one can and should take: that Horikoshi was wrong and should do better.

[Robby]

Okay folks, staff is actually getting complaints now. i think you've veered waaaaaaay off the topic this thread is for. Some off topic is fine from time to time, and the themes of the series lend themselves to some of this discussion, but.

Take the discussion somewhere else or let it go. Gonna let things cool off for a while to make sure people see this note, will reopen later.

[King Cannon]

The problem is that Horikawa doesn't really seem to buy into authoritarianism (the heroes) as being wrong. There's not enough of a strong depiction of the 'villains' as being the protagonists: Toga, Jin, and Mag-nee are victims of a broken system. They're an allegory for the real world's marginalized people. Hell, Mag-nee IS a real world marginalized person: she is a trans woman who turned to crime to survive. The hero Tiger is reward with being a 'proper citizen' by being able to transition, Mag-nee is punished by not being allowed to transition. It's an extremely transphobic message and goes to show Horikawa and JUMP editorial are only thinking about making sure the children reading this comic are good little soldiers for authority when they grow up.

You're describing the inherent problem of superhero fiction.

Captain America: Civil War? The good guys are trying to fight for their right to not be held accountable for their international operations. Heck, secret identities as a big fuck you to accountability and even the most progressive of hero comics still use them.

MHA is not any less authoritarian than any other superhero comic book. Most well-known villains are marginalized to some extent. Hell, all of Batman's villains are mental patients, who get their asses kicked by a vigilante member of the 1%. The X-Men, who does its damned best to humanize Magneto as a holocaust survivor, still has the holocaust survivor as the resident archnemesis, plus all the aforementioned issues of paramilitarism and unaccountability.

Funnily enough, One Piece ends up being one of the most leftist manga out there since the plotline is about "criminals" toppling auhoritarian regimes everywhere they go, in spite of the outdated women and trans jokes.

I do not want to restart the debate out of respect for Robby, but if the idea of a forum is to debate and be critical, then I think it is useful to at least remind everybody of the inherent messages of their favorite works and rethink about them. Just treat this as more of an advice than an actual debate point.

And to remain on-topic, I'm kinda mixed on the whole OFA ghost battle thing. On one this was foreshadowed since God known when, so it's not like it came from nowhere. On the other, it's still silly that the whole thing is getting based on Revolver Ocelot pseudoscience.

[pariston_hill]

Break next week

Spoiler:

The spoilers suggest Jeanist is alive, so there's on card less for Dabi's reveal stream.

[King Cannon]

Right now, I'm expecting the whole OFA world confrontation to have been the result of Tomura hypnotizing himself with nanomachines to make himself think AFO was with him all along.

[pariston_hill]

Right now, I'm expecting the whole OFA world confrontation to have been the result of Tomura hypnotizing himself with nanomachines to make himself think AFO was with him all along.

Nah, this is our version of force ghosts. AFO was aware when his little bro had his OFA world talk with Deku.

[King Cannon]

Nah, this is our version of force ghosts. AFO was aware when his little bro had his OFA world talk with Deku.

Because Metal Gear doesn't have force ghosts as well?

When do I get the scene where All Might at death's door crosses a river in the netherworld while the ghosts of his victims chase after him? All while the ghost of Sirnighteye haunts him with one-second flashes of war imagery?

[pariston_hill]

Never player Metal Gear can't tell.

[JulieYBM]

I just realized I've been calling Horikoshi 'Horikawa' and now I want to crawl into a hole and not come out. :lol:

[maxterdexter]

One Piece and toppling countries: it always (except drum) falls back to their original rightful and god given ruler, or Iceburg, who is a mayor in a world of Monarchs, somehow. Even the world government is implied to be usurpers, the revolutionaries of the blank century becoming fat and complacent on their new throne.

[Cyclone_Baroness]

I just realized I've been calling Horikoshi 'Horikawa' and now I want to crawl into a hole and not come out. :lol:

I just assumed your phone was doing an autocorrect thing lol