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Thread: Random News Article Discussion II

  1. #13801

    Default Re: Random News Article Discussion II: is racism racist?

    Quote Originally Posted by algebro View Post
    Er I didn't think I did but if so that wasn't my intention. I only framed my argument in blacks and whites because the video was about whether blacks can be racist. I wouldn't assume to know anybody's race I haven't met. The big assumption I made was that most of the posters were Hilary supporters which could be false.
    Zephos is commenting on the fact that at least one of the people in the discussion here who is most heavily on the side that says individual racial prejudice should be viewed as equal regardless of the context is himself a black American. But, as you say, you weren't presenting your argument based on the people in this exact discussion, but rather on Americans in general who seem invested in this debate.

    Quote Originally Posted by Monkey King View Post
    I don't see how it does that at all, it specifies things down and sidesteps virtually all of what I mentioned in the process.
    As I already said, you're right. The redefinition of the word as I've suggested definitely overlooks a lot of the complexities of racism, but I think that it does zero in on one of the most important aspects of it... and certainly one of the aspects that are most relevant at this stage of the discussion and at this point in history.

    Quote Originally Posted by Monkey King View Post
    Racism is in the same field regardless of the definition here though? It's all sociological?
    There's usually a big difference between the common use of a word and its specialized definition within a hard science. Just because the common use of the word in this case has a specific purpose in describing a social interaction does not mean that the common definitions have to match with the more precise definition within the relevant field of science, in this case sociology.

    Quote Originally Posted by Monkey King View Post
    It's not going to happened man.
    Like I said, not everyone you meet on the street knows what the words power, force, pressure, etc. mean in the strict physical sense. But several will, and having strict definitions for what these words mean within a field of science does lend some credence to these definitions. Even common folk will recognize that these specialized definitions exist and serve a necessary purpose.

    Quote Originally Posted by Monkey King View Post
    The thing that makes your whole argument kind of nonsensical is that you are pushing this definition because it would help enlighten people to the matter of power/status. But then the people who are using it are people who are already entirely well aware of that, and it almost requires one to already be enlightened for it to even be considered.
    So ...who is it enlightening?
    Meanwhile it still skips over a blizzard of complexities and seems to almost stem from a conversation of racism involving blacks and whites and....no other real aspect.
    The people that I think a more specialized definition of the word racism will enlighten are the next generation. Most of the people you're talking about who won't give such a scientific use of the word a second thought are already lost causes. I don't honestly give half a shit what people like that will think about this topic. As you've said, they're essentially unreachable. For that reason, we shouldn't even worry about what they would think about this debate.

    Quote Originally Posted by Monkey King View Post
    It's not.
    I'm going to have to suggest that your opinion here differs from mine simply due to a difference of experiences out in the real world.

    Quote Originally Posted by Monkey King View Post
    The people most in need of realizing the power factor are the people who will MOST strongly reject this use of the word.
    That is most certainly true. But I still have hope for future generations.

    Quote Originally Posted by Monkey King View Post
    It's not that it is academic, it is that it has the feel of something strictly academic. Something being taught to the pre-disposed and already advanced and deeply interested. When unlike sharing advanced theoretical physics, this issue is deeply constantly important to all of everyone there is.
    This is a good point. My only hope is that any progress made in redefining racism in the context of hard sociology will ultimately help to spread that conceptualization of the problem to other cultures and younger minds. But, as I said before, perhaps I'm wrong and it was a lost cause before the debate even started. Only time will tell, I think.

    Quote Originally Posted by wolfwood View Post
    It's way more hurtful when you get to hear those long diatribes about how white people are soulless abominations.
    I've literally never heard anyone of note describe white people this way, and I'm not really sure where you're getting this from. If it does truly exist, then I would agree that it is a good example of extreme racial prejudice towards whites... but again I don't really think it counts as racism because racism itself is so inextricably linked to ingrained societal and institutional problems with perception of and behavior towards racial minorities.

  2. #13802

    Default Re: Random News Article Discussion II: is racism racist?

    Quote Originally Posted by benjamminbrown View Post
    I've literally never heard anyone of note describe white people this way, and I'm not really sure where you're getting this from. If it does truly exist, then I would agree that it is a good example of extreme racial prejudice towards whites... but again I don't really think it counts as racism because racism itself is so inextricably linked to ingrained societal and institutional problems with perception of and behavior towards racial minorities.
    Person of note would be quite a stretch to say about the man on campus who said this.

    That particular diatribe was aimed at friend of mine who happend to be dating a white guy at the time.

  3. #13803

    Default Re: Random News Article Discussion II: is racism racist?

    Quote Originally Posted by wolfwood View Post
    Person of note would be quite a stretch to say about the man on campus who said this.

    That particular diatribe was aimed at friend of mine who happend to be dating a white guy at the time.
    Ah. Well, indeed, screw that "person". In my experience, it's far more common for that exact line ("soulless monster") to be used in describing people of racial minorities.

    It's despicable either way, but I think that one of the examples is more harmful than the other because it is more common, more acceptable, and perhaps a root cause of the problem of racism as a whole.

  4. #13804

    Default Re: Random News Article Discussion II: is racism racist?

    Quote Originally Posted by sgamer82 View Post
    In other news:
    http://www.houstonpress.com/news/hou...trolls-9488700

    Texas Antifa, a group that planned a protest rally to remove the statue of Sam Houston, was actually an alt-right trolling group. Evidenced by details such as removing the statue never even being on the mayor's agenda, the more established Houston Antifa made clear that they weren't affiliated and insisted nobody go to the rally, and, when called on this and asked for comment, Texas Antifa responded via Facebook "Being called fake works in our favor. It will bring down how many will go to the counter protest. No more comments, sorry."
    a friend posted about this on FB a week or so ago and i immediately picked up that it was a troll account. The fb page said "lololol" in a comment, so it wasnt difficult

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  5. #13805

    Default Re: Random News Article Discussion II: is racism racist?

    So there is an attack in London. A guy just crushed a few people with a car.


    And to think that Theresa May was threatening the EU (not long ago) to not give them the intel of their intelligence (MI-5 and else) if they didn't get a good deal for the Brexit....

  6. #13806
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    Default Re: Random News Article Discussion II: is racism racist?

    Quote Originally Posted by algebro View Post
    Not to fan any flames but I can definitely see where benjammin is coming from and I think a lot of you are off base when you talk about his points. The sunny conclusion that the video draws, that we should all just stick to calling racists racist no matter the color or situation, is exactly what the "blacks can't be racist" crowd is trying to fight.
    Racism does not exist in every situation. The video draws no such conclusion. The only conclusion the video draws is, it'd be a good starting point if racist behaivor can be called racist regardless of color. If the video went into situational awareness then we'd be having a discussion about the effects of racism on one race compared to another and even going into specific situations but... it's not talking about that. It's talking about the bare minimum of what is racism.

    And, again, it's talking about a 'starting point' for defining and discussing racism. It's not equating things like, 'this is as equally racist as that.'

    As The effort didn't come about because some African Americans thought sociological re-contextualization of definitions was cool, it happened as a reaction to some white people viewing racism as an equal game. If racism, which is already a loaded word in America, is best used on the individual level that everyone is accustomed to, then to the average individual there is no difference between a white person calling a black person the N word and a black person calling a white person a cracker. Just a couple of racists. For whom would that definition be most beneficial?
    The people who actually believe racism is an "equal game" aren't even going to believe in things like institutional racism and especially not something like only white people can be racist. Redefine the word and you should understand that you're leaving it open for people to definine it as they prefer, or even for it to be redefined later. That's natural of course, language is always adapting, but it's more impactful to get people to understand the impact racism has had and continues to have on this country.

    Accepting racism as is does not prevent you from having simultaneous discussions about racism and its varying effects depending on social context. Like taking your example, 'Hey, someone might have called you a cracker but this is why the "N-Word" is much more harmful'.

    It just doesn't resonate with the average person, which is unfortunate because it means that meaningful conversations about racism in this country will remain a pipe dream for now.
    Doubt it. Relevant conversations about race have been going on this country for quite awhile now.

    Quote Originally Posted by benjamminbrown View Post
    Zephos is commenting on the fact that at least one of the people in the discussion here who is most heavily on the side that says individual racial prejudice should be viewed as equal regardless of the context is himself a black American.


    I hope you're not referring to me because that would be very off from what I've been saying.

    "...the disparity of how racism affects minorities several magnitudes larger than any racism a white person might experience..."

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  7. #13807

    Default Re: Random News Article Discussion II: is racism racist?

    Quote Originally Posted by benjamminbrown View Post
    I've literally never heard anyone of note describe white people this way, and I'm not really sure where you're getting this from. If it does truly exist, then I would agree that it is a good example of extreme racial prejudice towards whites... but again I don't really think it counts as racism because racism itself is so inextricably linked to ingrained societal and institutional problems with perception of and behavior towards racial minorities.
    Stuff like this is what bothers me about the conversation.

    It literally is racism if you espouse the idea that someone else is inferior to you due to being of a different race, which is exactly what is happening here. That it doesn't connect to systemic racism or institutionalized racism doesn't mean shit because it still is racism

    It seems like you're assuming that any instance of racism HAS to be systemic or institutionalized for it to just be racism, which is a terrible way to malform the definition into a comfy reality where only oppressors are racist and the oppressed as a result have no moral or social responsibility to NOT be racist. It creates a dialogue where we condemn racism from whites to blacks, but we shrug off racism from black to whites. And to me that's a dangerous case of "bad when THEY do it, ok when WE do", which is dangerous identity politics to play whether you are in a majority or minority position.

    Now, naturally, like Algebro says, sometimes the fact that one side has the system and institutions perpetuating their racist ideologies makes that more dangerous and as a result more worthy of public consideration and protest
    I can understand that some black people would hold racist thoughts as a result of fear (eg. not wanting to be alone while with a group of white males in a southern state) or as a result of having to develop an identity as a response to persecution, etc. These are cases that, while still racism, we don't condemn the affected because their racist behavior is a direct result of the racism pervasive in the system.
    But this whole mentality that "academically" we need to disregard one thing as racist and one as not racist is to me the core of hypocrisy: the idea that white people need to behave and watch how they behave and act because they are "oppressors", regardless of who they are historically or as individuals, but it's totally ok for us to group an entire set of people under an umbrella and deny them access or speech or any right to complain. It's that same bullshit that keeps landing us in this of people reacting to the actions of bad people on any side by wanting to damage their ENTIRE group, which is serious bullshit.

  8. #13808
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    Default Re: Random News Article Discussion II: is racism racist?

    Quote Originally Posted by Outerspec View Post
    Racism does not exist in every situation. The video draws no such conclusion. The only conclusion the video draws is, it'd be a good starting point if racist behaivor can be called racist regardless of color. If the video went into situational awareness then we'd be having a discussion about the effects of racism on one race compared to another and even going into specific situations but... it's not talking about that. It's talking about the bare minimum of what is racism.

    And, again, it's talking about a 'starting point' for defining and discussing racism. It's not equating things like, 'this is as equally racist as that.'
    I agree here. However, the problem is that I think the video conflates prejudice and bigotry with racism, which isn't egregious because historically the two have often been linked and used in place of one another. It means that it is missing the point of the argument.

    The people who actually believe racism is an "equal game" aren't even going to believe in things like institutional racism and especially not something like only white people can be racist. Redefine the word and you should understand that you're leaving it open for people to definine it as they prefer, or even for it to be redefined later. That's natural of course, language is always adapting, but it's more impactful to get people to understand the impact racism has had and continues to have on this country.

    Accepting racism as is does not prevent you from having simultaneous discussions about racism and its varying effects depending on social context. Like taking your example, 'Hey, someone might have called you a cracker but this is why the "N-Word" is much more harmful'.
    You are correct that there are many people who are lost causes, and it may indeed be more impactful to try and combat racism through other arguments. The argument here was intentionally designed to be controversial and shocking, and honestly I don't think that it is an effective way to spark dialogue with people who don't already agree with. However, that doesn't make the premise of the argument wrong. Also, I disagree that redefining the word, and I think a better term would be refining the word, leaves it open for interpretation.

    Sociologists differentiate racism from prejudice and bigotry because racism is such a vast concept that using it in a simplified manner is not concise enough. We already have words that define racism on a primary individual level. Racism was just always chunked with them because A. its easier, and B. nobody really gave a crap about the distinctions until around 30 years ago. Just because people still use it that way doesn't make it right. For comparison, the concept of gender and fluidity have also been going through rapid change in sociological circles yet many people still think that gender refers to whether you are a man or a woman. Is there no merit in trying to get people to understand that sex and gender aren't the same thing simply because we've historically considered them the same?

    Doubt it. Relevant conversations about race have been going on this country for quite awhile now.
    When I watch the news, listen to politicians speak, or hear friends complain about interactions in their lives I am not convinced. Heck, a great deal of Americans thought we were living in a post-racial America because we elected an African American president just 8 years ago. I hope you're right but I just don't see it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Noqanky View Post
    Stuff like this is what bothers me about the conversation.

    It literally is racism if you espouse the idea that someone else is inferior to you due to being of a different race, which is exactly what is happening here. That it doesn't connect to systemic racism or institutionalized racism doesn't mean shit because it still is racism

    It seems like you're assuming that any instance of racism HAS to be systemic or institutionalized for it to just be racism, which is a terrible way to malform the definition into a comfy reality where only oppressors are racist and the oppressed as a result have no moral or social responsibility to NOT be racist. It creates a dialogue where we condemn racism from whites to blacks, but we shrug off racism from black to whites. And to me that's a dangerous case of "bad when THEY do it, ok when WE do", which is dangerous identity politics to play whether you are in a majority or minority position.
    I just want to say that I 100% agree that the idea that we should shrug off or downplay discrimination, prejudice, and bigotry from any source, majority or minority, is not ok. And the fact that you say it literally is racism underlines I believe the best point that the video makes. These conversations can't be productive if both sides aren't speaking the same language.

    This idea is based on the premise that racism has been redefined to encompass a grander scope from the current vernacular use. In that context, it would not be literally racist. It would cease to meet the requirements for racism. Other words like bigot would replace racist in common language, and people would still be able to call out minorities on their prejudices. As far as I understand, it is not designed to be a singling out tool for majority groups, although it is easy to see how that can be perceived and is ultimately why I believe this style of tactic is flawed. Now, is it practical or effective to try to change the functional definition of such a charged word by force? That's for you to decide.
    Last edited by algebro; June 3rd, 2017 at 11:19 PM.

  9. #13809

    Default Re: Random News Article Discussion II: is racism racist?

    http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk...-a7771896.html

    In the wake of the London Bridge attack, Theresa May has made a fresh call to regulate the internet.

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  10. #13810

    Default Re: Random News Article Discussion II: is racism racist?

    Quote Originally Posted by Outerspec View Post
    I hope you're not referring to me because that would be very off from what I've been saying.

    "...the disparity of how racism affects minorities several magnitudes larger than any racism a white person might experience..."

    http://forums.arlongpark.net/showthr...=1#post3790246
    Sorry, I do know that you consider racial prejudice to be worse when directed at people who are already suffering under what I call racism. By "equal", I mean that you and others are in favor of calling racial prejudice the same thing, regardless of context. That's where I think the problem lies.

    Quote Originally Posted by Noqanky View Post
    Stuff like this is what bothers me about the conversation...
    In no way am I saying that racial prejudice is okay, no matter who it comes from and who it is directed toward. I'm simply saying that by giving racial prejudice on the individual scale the name racism, regardless of context, you are allowing people to assume that such prejudice is an equally bad thing no matter how it exhibits itself. And I think that is the biggest problem with our modern, common use of the word.

  11. #13811

    Default Re: Random News Article Discussion II: is racism racist?

    Quote Originally Posted by benjamminbrown View Post
    In no way am I saying that racial prejudice is okay, no matter who it comes from and who it is directed toward. I'm simply saying that by giving racial prejudice on the individual scale the name racism, regardless of context, you are allowing people to assume that such prejudice is an equally bad thing no matter how it exhibits itself. And I think that is the biggest problem with our modern, common use of the word.
    Um, no, that makes no sense. In fact, I'd argue it's the opposite. Stuff like those college incidents of keeping whites off campus is the sort of fuel that gives asshole racists on the right ground to continue questioning the legitimacy of the discussion.

    Yes, context matters, but you're taking it to a ridiculous level where you don't even want to acknowledge that people are being racist when they're literally being racist, just because it doesn't fit the narrative you want to adhere to. It makes no sense to demand people in power to work against systemic racism while giving yourself and others on your side a free pass to not work on improving the state of things.

  12. #13812
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    Default Re: Random News Article Discussion II: is racism racist?

    Quote Originally Posted by MDL View Post
    http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk...-a7771896.html

    In the wake of the London Bridge attack, Theresa May has made a fresh call to regulate the internet.
    Jesus Christ. What is up with conservative parties and their antagonism towards the internet? What does she think is going to happen when you get involved in regulating what is essentially the modern equivalent of the ancient Forums? The internet is the purest form os free speech we have today, and putting stops on it is not going to stop a fanatic from taking a van and riding through a crowd anytime soon. She might as well forbid news agencies from talking about terrorist attacks and anything related to that, since it might inspire others. Oh, and let's close all mosques as well, since some of them have guys spewing extremist rethoric. This lady is coming across as more and more anti-democratic every time she speaks, which is ironic considering how quickly she accepted the result of the brexit referendum.

  13. #13813

    Default Re: Random News Article Discussion II: is racism racist?

    There should just be a few more cops around the bridges, it seems all the attacks are happing there.

  14. #13814
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    Default Re: Random News Article Discussion II: is racism racist?

    They had no way of knowing an attack would take place on a bridge.

    The infuriating thing about these attacks and the people who commit them is that most of the time, these are people with checkered pasts who are becoming self-radicalized on their own via the internet.

    Sometimes if the person attends a mosque and the warning signs are seen, then the community intervenes or reports them well before they do anything (this actually just happened over here, this guy was a well known radical and was reported by the Muslim community http://www.cbc.ca/beta/news/canada/t...rror-1.4144608 ), but most of the time these people are barely involved in the Muslim community and nobody knows them and are able to challenge their false rhetoric in time.
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  15. #13815
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    Default Re: Random News Article Discussion II: is racism racist?

    Quote Originally Posted by algebro View Post
    I agree here. However, the problem is that I think the video conflates prejudice and bigotry with racism, which isn't egregious because historically the two have often been linked and used in place of one another. It means that it is missing the point of the argument.
    Does the video really miss the point though when it clearly recognizes the basis of the argument, power + prejudice = racism? It's pretty straightforward actually, the thinking, racism isn't just prejudice or bigotry, it's more. But the problem pointed out in that argument is it conflates institutional and individual racism with no option to apply the terms outside of a certain race, in any context (of American history). Which leads to problems of one group only being able to call out racist behavior using "lesser" and can be argued "inadequate" terms.

    It's understood that advocates don't want people equating all racism as equal, hell, I agree with that, but excluding entire races from the word "racist" does not move any conversation forward but rather begins a game of semantics where other groups feel like any racist behavior they're doing is not as bad on any level because they're exempt from any such labeling.

    Also, I disagree that redefining the word, and I think a better term would be refining the word, leaves it open for interpretation.
    Language is always open for interpretation. For example, some people view the current definition for racism is open for interpretation and refining...

    Sociologists differentiate racism from prejudice and bigotry because racism is such a vast concept that using it in a simplified manner is not concise enough. We already have words that define racism on a primary individual level. Racism was just always chunked with them because A. its easier, and B. nobody really gave a crap about the distinctions until around 30 years ago. Just because people still use it that way doesn't make it right.
    Sociologist also differentiate institutional racism from individual racism but you're paying no heed to that. You're right, racism is a vast concept, it's a complex social construct, and that's why you can break it down to the difference between individualistic racism and institutional racism. There's even a difference in the effects of individualistic racism depending on the individuals involved, but it's still racism. Prejudice, bigotry, and discrimination, can be subsets of racism.

    Prejudice, discrimination, and bigotry help label ignorance about 'social status' beyond race as they can include sex, sexual orientation, religion, age, income, etc... You can't always use racism for those can you? That's what you have those words for. Not to stop you from calling racist behavior racist depending on the color of the person's skin and whether or not their group has more power.

    For comparison, the concept of gender and fluidity have also been going through rapid change in sociological circles yet many people still think that gender refers to whether you are a man or a woman. Is there no merit in trying to get people to understand that sex and gender aren't the same thing simply because we've historically considered them the same?
    Telling the difference between sex and gender does not exclude anybody like you're trying to make the difference between racism and prejudice. The whole purpose is to exclude and point out the power dynamic right? Well, anybody can have a sex and gender. Men who behave in a "feminine manner" can be considered; sex = male and gender = feminine. Women who behave in a "masculine manner" can be considered; sex = female and gender = masculine. The difference in sex and gender is applicable to all no matter if women have been the historically disenfranchised group. The merit in pointing out the difference between sex and gender is so that both man and woman can feel more comfortable with a better understanding that it's ok to behave in whatever manner is comfortable to them, in regards to sex and gender fluidity.

    On the other hand, you're saying not anybody can be racist? Your behavior is either racist or prejudice forever depending on your skin color? If you want to point out the power dynamic that's what institutional racism is for or even "white privilege". Yes, there's a merit in being educated in the difference between sex and gender as well as racism and prejudice but the analogies don't exactly match up, which I'm sure you weren't trying to do, but the flaw is your exclusionary interpretation or refining of the word racism changes something that doesn't need to be changed. What needs to be changed is people's understanding of how deep racism goes and its effects on society.

    Quote Originally Posted by MDL View Post
    http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk...-a7771896.html

    In the wake of the London Bridge attack, Theresa May has made a fresh call to regulate the internet.
    Regulating the internet can be a number of things. In a way they already regulate the internet by enforcing security and rules through laws and policies to protect consumers and companies which is a good thing. What I'm guessing here is that "regulate the internet" means more means of spying and tracking consumers.
    Everything's Eventual...


  16. #13816

    Default Re: Random News Article Discussion II: is racism racist?

    Quote Originally Posted by Noqanky View Post
    Yes, context matters, but you're taking it to a ridiculous level where you don't even want to acknowledge that people are being racist when they're literally being racist, just because it doesn't fit the narrative you want to adhere to. It makes no sense to demand people in power to work against systemic racism while giving yourself and others on your side a free pass to not work on improving the state of things.
    I'm not giving a free pass to anyone. You're misinterpreting what I am saying if that's what you think I mean. It's not about fitting a narrative, it's about acknowledging the reality of just how damaging systematic racism is to society as a whole. If you think that's hypocritical, so be it. I think that we are talking past each other at this point because you and others keep wanting to frame what I am saying into something that I most certainly am not.

    Edit: Just to be clear, I'm a white guy. Even if I was trying to do what you say I am (which I'm not), it wouldn't be in an attempt to give myself a "free pass".
    Last edited by benjamminbrown; June 4th, 2017 at 10:37 AM.

  17. #13817

    Default Re: Random News Article Discussion II: is racism racist?

    Quote Originally Posted by Femme View Post
    They had no way of knowing an attack would take place on a bridge.

    The infuriating thing about these attacks and the people who commit them is that most of the time, these are people with checkered pasts who are becoming self-radicalized on their own via the internet.

    Sometimes if the person attends a mosque and the warning signs are seen, then the community intervenes or reports them well before they do anything (this actually just happened over here, this guy was a well known radical and was reported by the Muslim community http://www.cbc.ca/beta/news/canada/t...rror-1.4144608 ), but most of the time these people are barely involved in the Muslim community and nobody knows them and are able to challenge their false rhetoric in time.
    Yes but I'm just saying there has been a few attacks on the bridges, maybe they should just look over there and do something I don't know.


    and yeah sometimes the people at the mosque do something, and sometimes the dude who's impersonating a radicalized douche is actually a spy lol (happened a few times around Paris).

  18. #13818
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    Default Re: Random News Article Discussion II: is racism racist?

    Quote Originally Posted by benjamminbrown View Post
    I'm not giving a free pass to anyone. You're misinterpreting what I am saying if that's what you think I mean. It's not about fitting a narrative, it's about acknowledging the reality of just how damaging systematic racism is to society as a whole. If you think that's hypocritical, so be it. I think that we are talking past each other at this point because you and others keep wanting to frame what I am saying into something that I most certainly am not.
    What we're talking about, calling racism...racism, is not about putting all racism on equal ground though. It's about getting on common ground, identifying a problem and calling it what it is. It's to make sure racist behavior is not...minimized. Beyond that, recognizing the different effects of racism and the underlying problem shadowing America like a inner demon, systematic racism, and how that extends to the legitimate problem of how racism adversely affects certain groups more than others is a discussion on top of that discussion.

    --- Update From New Post Merge ---

    Quote Originally Posted by Femme View Post
    They had no way of knowing an attack would take place on a bridge.

    The infuriating thing about these attacks and the people who commit them is that most of the time, these are people with checkered pasts who are becoming self-radicalized on their own via the internet.

    Sometimes if the person attends a mosque and the warning signs are seen, then the community intervenes or reports them well before they do anything (this actually just happened over here, this guy was a well known radical and was reported by the Muslim community http://www.cbc.ca/beta/news/canada/t...rror-1.4144608 ), but most of the time these people are barely involved in the Muslim community and nobody knows them and are able to challenge their false rhetoric in time.
    Oh, news like that, really, most news regarding thwarted attacks, rarely make news and much less grab headlines. People don't often hear about things like this and that's a part of the problem.

    What they more often hear and see instead is brown skinned guy of other religion participated in ANOTHER attack which is probably making you think there's something wrong with those people and/or that religion.
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    Default Re: Random News Article Discussion II: is racism racist?

    Quote Originally Posted by Nilitch View Post
    Yes but I'm just saying there has been a few attacks on the bridges, maybe they should just look over there and do something I don't know.

    and yeah sometimes the people at the mosque do something, and sometimes the dude who's impersonating a radicalized douche is actually a spy lol (happened a few times around Paris).
    That leads me to another point that needs to be more well known, though. The Muslim community in mosques can do something about these individuals.. only if they come to the mosque and participate and get to know people. More often than not these criminals are loners, don't mingle with others, and barely know anything about Islam. Mosque congregants cannot take responsibility for people they don't know, and it would be good if people understand that so all Muslims aren't painted with the same brush.

    Quote Originally Posted by Outerspec View Post
    Oh, news like that, really, most news regarding thwarted attacks, rarely make news and much less grab headlines. People don't often hear about things like this and that's a part of the problem.

    What they more often hear and see instead is brown skinned guy of other religion participated in ANOTHER attack which is probably making you think there's something wrong with those people and/or that religion.
    It's such a burden, honestly. It's mentally exhausting having to be shocked by these attacks as much as everyone else and then basically have to reassure everyone you know like "I'm a normal one, guys!" lol.
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  20. #13820

    Default Re: Random News Article Discussion II: is racism racist?

    Now i know one shouldn't expect too much sense out of violent fanatics. But i've always found it strange how they can theologically reconcile making these attacks during what is, atleast as i understand it, one of (if not the) most sacred time of the year for muslims during which you are supposed to focus on self-improvement and good deeds. But i guess it's framed as a "good deed", or fighting back or whatever.

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